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eumeliaVia a comment on a different journal, I read that the mod of the My Chemical Romance Bandom com on LJ wrote a response to what has been going down with the aforementioned AU H/C Bingo fic, in which a depiction of the Holocaust, the camps and the treatment of gays during that time was used as a backdrop for angst of two US soldiers.
Yeah, I read the story.
It makes me fingers itch. I want to grab a red pen and mark and correct and fucking rip that story inside out until something resembling "adequate" comes out of it.
The mod, has this to say:
In the words of George Carlin: Shit, Piss, Fuck, Cunt, Cocksucker, Motherfucker, Tits.
You know what I did there?
I executed my right to "free speech", are you offended?
Maybe.
You know what you have a right to do now?
TELL ME ABOUT IT! AT LENGTH! HOW I OFFENDED YOU WITH MY WORDS!
Yeah, really.
I find it utterly, utterly despicable that criticism of offensive material is considered more offensive than the actual subject discussed.
I hate getting personal about it, but it has to be done, because honestly, it's the only way to get it through people's heads.
I am a Queer Jewish Person.
Depictions of gays and Jewish people during the Holocaust matter to me, on a personal level. You know why? Because whole branches of my family tree were eradicated! An entire Queer European Culture was erased!
After the camps were liberated, gay men were sent to other prisons because homosexuality was still illegal regardless of Nazi legislation!
Yes.
Seriously.
Just to put that into perspective for you.
The story in question depicted horrors which happened. That is not the problem, the fact that it was used in a cavalier manner, disregarded the actual lives that lived through it, didn't bother to check the facts of what went on in concentration camps, the fact that American soldiers were sent to POW camps and of course putting the picture of the Gates to Auschwitz in order to illustrate the story.
Yes, these stories are fictional, that doesn't make them "untrue", that doesn't mean that the you can use the material available to you without considering who it affects and what it might mean if you use it. If you wanted to explore the themes and torture committed by the Nazi regime onto gays, you might want to find out what actually happened to these men, who they were, why they were persecuted and where they were sent to.
Let me give you a hint, none of them were captured POW experimented upon, mainly because non-Soviet Ally POW's were treated with the Geneva convention in mind.
Just, FYI.
Fiction does not mean "free for all". You do not write in a vacuum. You cannot say "Don't like, don't read", that's like saying "Shut up, your problems are meaningless".
Fiction, all art, is a dialogue.
You want to dialogue with history via fanfiction, by all means. That doesn't mean you, dear author, are immune from criticism when you are writing a story that depicts a period of time with gross inaccuracy and decides that any and all critical reaction to said story is illegitimate because it was "just a story".
Nothing, is "just a story".
We do not live in a vacuum, what you write will be reacted to, fiction is not a vehicle of self-expression, being accused of bad writing and bad taste is not a personal attack, it is a challenge to one's preconceived notions of what good story telling can and should be.
Good story telling does not continue the dehumanisation of people that happened during that period of time, it does not use Arbeit Macht Frei as a code for free speech (it doesn't mean what you think it means!) and saying that people should "be nice to each other" is silencing and derailing and basically tells those of us who are affected by the depictions of our history to suck it up!
When I see a story that treats a subject matter that is close to my heart for historical, personal and identity related reasons treated with utter DISRESPECT I will call on it. I will say that this author does not care, does not think about and is not informed about the subject zie is writing for "just a story", for "self-expression", for the sake of "fiction".
To conclude, if you're going to use free speech as a silencing mechanism for critical reaction of a piece of fiction that depicts controversial material... you're using it wrong.
Yeah, I read the story.
It makes me fingers itch. I want to grab a red pen and mark and correct and fucking rip that story inside out until something resembling "adequate" comes out of it.
The mod, has this to say:
The story was properly disclaimed, and with plenty of warnings with regards to the themes it dealt with, therefore any comment that is not related to any possible literary criticism, should have been left alone.Emphasis mine
I chose not to read it at first, because I am uncomfortable with the themes dealt with, and that could have been the choice of all of those people who thought, at first glance, that they were going to find it offensive.
I am not going to ban this type of stories, because I still believe in freedom of speech and because I believe that if we ban stories that refer to that particular chapter in history, we need to ban stories about incest, about BDSM, torture, rape, and in one case necrophilia.
We write FICTION.
WE WRITE FICTIONAL STORIES.
These stories are not historically accurate, these stories ARE NOT just written for sexual gratification.
These stories express part of who we are, what we feel, what lives inside our heads and our hearts.
I hope you will agree that RESPECT for your feelings as readers, should find a corresponding level of RESPECT for the writers.
In the words of George Carlin: Shit, Piss, Fuck, Cunt, Cocksucker, Motherfucker, Tits.
You know what I did there?
I executed my right to "free speech", are you offended?
Maybe.
You know what you have a right to do now?
TELL ME ABOUT IT! AT LENGTH! HOW I OFFENDED YOU WITH MY WORDS!
Yeah, really.
I find it utterly, utterly despicable that criticism of offensive material is considered more offensive than the actual subject discussed.
I hate getting personal about it, but it has to be done, because honestly, it's the only way to get it through people's heads.
I am a Queer Jewish Person.
Depictions of gays and Jewish people during the Holocaust matter to me, on a personal level. You know why? Because whole branches of my family tree were eradicated! An entire Queer European Culture was erased!
After the camps were liberated, gay men were sent to other prisons because homosexuality was still illegal regardless of Nazi legislation!
Yes.
Seriously.
Just to put that into perspective for you.
The story in question depicted horrors which happened. That is not the problem, the fact that it was used in a cavalier manner, disregarded the actual lives that lived through it, didn't bother to check the facts of what went on in concentration camps, the fact that American soldiers were sent to POW camps and of course putting the picture of the Gates to Auschwitz in order to illustrate the story.
Yes, these stories are fictional, that doesn't make them "untrue", that doesn't mean that the you can use the material available to you without considering who it affects and what it might mean if you use it. If you wanted to explore the themes and torture committed by the Nazi regime onto gays, you might want to find out what actually happened to these men, who they were, why they were persecuted and where they were sent to.
Let me give you a hint, none of them were captured POW experimented upon, mainly because non-Soviet Ally POW's were treated with the Geneva convention in mind.
Just, FYI.
Fiction does not mean "free for all". You do not write in a vacuum. You cannot say "Don't like, don't read", that's like saying "Shut up, your problems are meaningless".
Fiction, all art, is a dialogue.
You want to dialogue with history via fanfiction, by all means. That doesn't mean you, dear author, are immune from criticism when you are writing a story that depicts a period of time with gross inaccuracy and decides that any and all critical reaction to said story is illegitimate because it was "just a story".
Nothing, is "just a story".
We do not live in a vacuum, what you write will be reacted to, fiction is not a vehicle of self-expression, being accused of bad writing and bad taste is not a personal attack, it is a challenge to one's preconceived notions of what good story telling can and should be.
Good story telling does not continue the dehumanisation of people that happened during that period of time, it does not use Arbeit Macht Frei as a code for free speech (it doesn't mean what you think it means!) and saying that people should "be nice to each other" is silencing and derailing and basically tells those of us who are affected by the depictions of our history to suck it up!
When I see a story that treats a subject matter that is close to my heart for historical, personal and identity related reasons treated with utter DISRESPECT I will call on it. I will say that this author does not care, does not think about and is not informed about the subject zie is writing for "just a story", for "self-expression", for the sake of "fiction".
To conclude, if you're going to use free speech as a silencing mechanism for critical reaction of a piece of fiction that depicts controversial material... you're using it wrong.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 10:12 am (UTC)Writing whatever you want, however you want = respect.
Criticising said writing = disrespect.
I see.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 10:20 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 10:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 11:01 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 11:06 am (UTC)Well said.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 11:10 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 01:32 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 11:06 am (UTC)And I guess who we are, what we feel, what and who has lived (and died) in our hearts doesn't matter.
"I hope you will agree that RESPECT for your feelings as readers, should find a corresponding level of RESPECT for the writers."
She's lucky nobody stooped that low.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 11:11 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 02:25 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 05:57 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 03:33 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 03:41 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 05:30 pm (UTC)Thanks in advance for the boost.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 05:38 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 07:49 pm (UTC)Write whatever you like, but don't be surprised when others write about how bad your writing is.
no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 08:01 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2010-07-07 10:45 pm (UTC)And I think I have lost any respect for that bandom (at least on LJ) that I may have had and I never really thought much of bandom in general already (I just...don't get most of bandom). They just don't get it do they?
I'm slightly hyper-aware of the sensitivity when it comes to the Holocaust because of a novel I'm working on. Fanfics like this disgust me because people just don't care about research. Inaccurate history is just asking for offending others. History is an important part of many people's identities.
Research and awareness is important. Why can't people understand this?