Another (short) entry on Gaza

[eumelia]

I wanted to write a more lengthy entry, but I have no time, I have to go to Uni.

The Islamic University was hit, thus, once again, leaving an educational lacuna which Hamas and other religious radicals will use to further their own agenda.
I just love Israeli foresight.
In theory.
Since, you know, it has not reared it's head since... yeah.

I never cease to be amazed how whenever the Palestinians raise up in arms, the mainstream Left talk becomes, "well, if only Hamas went the non-violent route", "well, they were firing rockets at us too", "it was really too much already, 50-70 rockets a day! The only reason they hadn't killed more people is because they can't aim".
Israel aims well and true.
Most of the targets were Hamas installations and facilities.
The majority of those killed in Gaza are said to be combatants.
The rest (children, mothers, fathers, brothers, sisters, cousins and plain bystanders) are... how you say?
Collateral.
Dehumanization at its most effective.
Amira Hass says it, as usual, best: Gaza strike is not against Hamas, it's against all Palestinians

So while this discourse is mouthed by the "rationales" (on the Israeli side) and Israel allowed some Humanitarian aid in - on their terms only, god forbid that the Palestinians become self-sufficient, hence the bombing of the tunnels on the Philadelphia line.

I suppose we can forget 40 years of Occupation and the fact that Israel helped create Hamas (ala Taliban style like the US did in Afganistan) so that the Palestinians themselves would fight the PLO - a major bit on the ass for Israel that one became.

I'd like to reiterate and say that I think Hamas are morally bankrupt fuckers.
I don't think Israel is that much better, except that we have more money, better weapons, international support and impunity and immunity to go on and do what the fuck ever in the name of "self-defence".
Which is what the land grabbing, "expansion of territory" and a seige on a civilian population centre were all about.
Obviously.

Comments

[shelestel.livejournal.com]

There's an importand division between foreign affairs and internal affairs. In internal affairs, addressing "their own" both Israel and the Hamas are reasonably good "organizations". In foreign affairs they both fail due to a mutual lack of trust, common language. It's so similar to how it is between two people who don't get along.

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

Two people who don't get along and are in an abusive relationship, I'd say.

[roga.livejournal.com]

Just, you know, randomly curious (or not so randomly :-)): Obviously you think there was a way of negotiating with Hamas. Which of their demands would you have agreed and not agreed to? What's your idea of a long term solution? (I think we've talked about this once, but my memory sucks at times, sorry... And if you're for a two-state solution, which again, sorry that I don't remember - do you have any idea of how it would work, with two separate territories for the Palestinian state?)

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

It's more that I don't think Israel is interested in negotiating with an entity that will lead to the conclusion that in fact the siege, the incursions, the סכולים ממוקדים are in fact decisions made not by lack of any other choice.

I don't even know what their demands are. I know that Israel's demand that they roll over and just accept the fact that we control all is unacceptable, I wouldn't accept that is I were them.
If their demands were infused with their usual vitriol of the destruction of Israel, I doubt our diplomats even bothered to listen to anything they had to say.
Our arrogance generally leaves us deaf to any narrative in which we aren't the victims.

I don't think a long term solutions should even be on the table by this point, because there is no way to know what can and can't be done until the Occupation is over, which is really what I'd think everyone wants (it's a question as to what you perceive the Occupation to be).

My ideal solution is a secular (total separation of religion and state) binational state, but that's a fantasy I don't see happening.
The rhetoric we hear is that of paranoia against being surrounded by enemies and the enemies within.

[lishablog.livejournal.com]

Sure, but how do we stop the occupation? This is my hearts deepest question.

I want an end to the occupation. I absolutely do. I cheered and was thrilled when Israel pulled out of Gaza, even though it was unilateral and all that bs. As far as I was and am concerned, we should just pull out of the West Bank unilaterally, too. Sure, the land will be divided by one group's choice at that point, but it would be -- should be -- a place to start. From there the Palestinian people can get on their knees, and then on their feet, and build something of their own, all while working through international negotiations to get a more reasonable permanent settlement.

(Do you know how many years it took Honduras to get its captured land back from El Salvador? 29 years. Oh, and the Salvadorans were given a choice of whether to stay on the land and become Hondurans or move elsewhere in El Salvador. Just sayin')

But, here's the problem. When Israel got out of Gaza, the rockets didn't stop, and the suicide bombings didn't stop. Getting out of Gaza didn't help bring us closer to peace, so people who want both peace and safety are hard pressed to say, "OK, let's just back out of some more territory!!"

I wish that I could come up with a comprehensive and reasonable political and diplomatic solution, because then I'd write an essay, a book, shout it from the roof tops, make youtube videos and gods knows what else! Seriously. But I haven't got that solution, so I'm left with thinking, "OK, we had to do SOMETHING. We can't just sit there and take rocket after rocket after rocket and do NOTHING."

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

I'd like to emphasise the unilateralism of Israel's actions.
Because really, that's where the problem is at. It's not that there isn't a "peace partner", it's that Israel isn't interested in making real compromises.
We can't leave unilaterally because that means leaving a destitute infrastructure and as much as we resent it, the Palestinians depend on Israeli infrastructure (in Gaza and the WB the currency in the NIS).

The rockets come because Israel isn't willing to accept the fact that the Palestinians chose a party and movement that won't pander to Israel and the US... and Israel just won't have that.

Bottom line, Israel has the massive fire power and is on a mighty hight horse. A little humility will go along way to keep at bay the humiliation.
Because is there's one thing everyone knows, this will not end well and will not solve anything. It will entrench the Palestinians deeper and deeper into despair and that will bring about even greater disaster for everyone.

[blue-braces.livejournal.com]

When Israel got out of Gaza, the rockets didn't stop, and the suicide bombings didn't stop. Getting out of Gaza didn't help bring us closer to peace, so people who want both peace and safety are hard pressed to say, "OK, let's just back out of some more territory!!"

Though Israel withdrew from having a presence in Gaza, it has had 100% control (with no negotiation as between two countries) of Gaza's borders with Israel, of Gaza's seacoast, and of Gaza's airspace. And Israel has a lot of influence on Gaza's border with Egypt. So, the Palestinians in Gaza continued to be, literally, prisoners. Since the "withdrawal" Israel has flown many warplanes over Gaza causing severe noise pollution (and psychological trauma) in Gaza, and then Israel wouldn't let any aid in to Gaza.

Also in the West Bank, Israel has proceeded not just to not "back out of some more territory" but to appropriate more and more territory, and to make life untenable for Palestinians there.

So, I'd say it's no wonder that "getting out of Gaza" didn't bring any advancements toward peace.

[lishablog.livejournal.com]

My ideal solution is a secular (total separation of religion and state) binational state, but that's a fantasy I don't see happening.
The rhetoric we hear is that of paranoia against being surrounded by enemies and the enemies within.

Actually, I'm interested in interviewing Israelis (of all nationalities) who are interested in the one state solution for StreamingIsrael (Which is going through a major re-launch process at the moment). Would you be interested??

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

Very very flattered :)

More info on the website and time to think, please?