Watching Harry Potter makes me write about Torchwood of course

[eumelia]

I went out with tamara_russo to see Harry Potter and the Half Blood Prince.

Yeah...

More on how it was too fucking long, too fucking boring and one again, too fucking shallow, at a later date.
It was very pretty though.

mao4269 wrote a very concise and gut-feeling review of Torchwood: Children of Earth on her LJ - It is spoilerrific.

As is what I have to say about it.
***Spoilers for Torchwood:Children of Earth... Don't say I didn't warn you!***
There has been a huge amount of discussion whether TW:CoE was homophobic or not. You just have to look at the links in yesterday's torchwood_three's newsletter to see what I mean.
In addition, I had a very fun and interesting discussion with sabotabby on that particular issue on her livejournal if you interested.
Everything is full of spoilers! You were warned.

My own personal viewing of the TW:CoE is that it is not homophobic. Like mentioned in the podcast I linked to, TW:CoE shows that homophobia in the outside world is still alive and kicking. Torchwood series 1 and 2 are very insulated. Their world is tiny and all encompassing, Gwen is the "odd man out" by actually maintaining a relationship outside of Torchwood and even then it is rife with problems that have serious ethical implications.

Torchwood, over all, does not show romantic relationships as being overly successful when one works in a job that the only thing that keeps you from dying is immortality (and being the POV character that is Gwen).

To say that killing off Ianto, a visibly Queer man, is homophobic is not only silly, but completely misses the point of what Ianto meant to Jack and Ianto's own character within the context of Torchwood over-all and CoE specifically.

Jack and Ianto's relationship is fucked up. Not because they are both men, but because these are two very fucked up individuals. The fact that only now they are "public" and Ianto is forced to be put under mainstream scrutiny doesn't make TW:CoE homophobic... it is the telling of the homophobic society in which they are now forced to interact because it's not just Aliens in Cardiff any more; it's all the children of the world and when it's global, it cannot be insular.

Which bring me to mao4269's post linked above.
She wrote, and I quote:

[O]n another level (this argument may be a stretch, I haven't decided yet), I think that the struggle in CoE paralleled the struggle to get the mainstream to address the AIDS epidemic. Ianto is very visibly gay in CoE. Not only do we see more commentary on his and Jack's relationship than we do in the rest of the show put together, but he even has a freaking scarlet letter on his cheek proclaiming (in the form of a lambda) his queerness! As for the disease, that's the 456. The first to be sacrificed to the 456 are a small number of people who "won't be missed", and even when the numbers grow the government attempts to continue hiding the problem by offering the 456 rejected asylum-seekers and other "undesirables". Similarly, HIV/AIDS wasn't even labeled until the 1980s when it began affecting Westerners. Then, the 456 demanded 10% of the population. Even with so many people affected, policy makers decide that it's better to sacrifice this portion of the population, and specifically target those who don't "help build the future generation of our society". The use of the 10% figure is an obvious parallel to gay issues, and the way that the 10% to be handed to the 456 are described is similar to rhetoric used to deny equal rights to G/L/B folk. And of course, it's Ianto, branded with his queerness, who says that rather than sacrifice the ten percent of the population that's least powerful for the sake of not jeopardizing the majority, they should fight back. In the end, he dies of a virus and his lover stops fighting for the least powerful.

Emphasis mine
I have to admit that wasn't a direction my mind took with the use of 10%. RTD has used that amount before - see the Master decimate Earth's population in DW Ep The Sound of Drums - I thought it wass just a theme and good large number he liked using, like reusing Smith, Jones, John etc.
However, the parallel of One in Ten when it comes to Queer issues does make a lot of sense if you look at it through the prism presented by mao4269.

It's a very interesting and provocative take on the themes of the show, especially with the preposterous accusations of homophobia being flung in RTD's direction.

It is problematic that a Queer character dies... it can be construed as Too Queer to Live, but Ianto dies heroically and on his own terms. By the way, anyone who says Ianto died a non-heroic death is plain blind, really. Saying "I love you" and in your lover's arms is not anti-heroic, is not sissy and is not, fact, "being a girl" - that's homophobic AND misogynistic, because if anyone had more acceptance of the fact that these were his last days on Earth it was Ianto. Ianto has been waiting to die for years and he waited while trying to save the world and defending those considered powerless and undesired. The way he probably saw himself more often than not.

I think the whole Dead Queer thing is subverted by the fact that he owns his queer identity. For fuck's sake he wears it on his cheek!
I'd also like to mention, that that type of casual homophobia (Johnny's greeting "Hey Gay Boy") is how the majority of us experience the world.
It is casual and sometimes you just don't have the strength to do anything else other than roll your eyes and bear it.

Final thoughts about owning the Queer identity.
In our pomo society, identity is not fixed, it would be easier for us if it were, but most of queer or not, do not remain the same as we go through our lives. I am not who I was three years ago... to be crude, neither is Ianto.

When Ianto says to his sister Rhiannon "It's not men, it's him... it's only him"... this is not Ianto denying his Queer identity, this is Ianto telling his sister he has found love again after his previous love died a very horrible death, you can bet Ianto would say "it's not women, it's her... it's only her" because that is the way Ianto rolls.
He loves.
He's just pretty insecure about other people loving him.

When Clem says he can smell "the Queer" from Ianto, it is in a scene that does not include Jack. Clem does not know of Jack's existence, their relationship, nada.
Clem can smell states of being (apparently), what that scene tells me is that Ianto's sexuality is his own.
He owns it and he makes choices about who he is sexual with, in the series it is with Jack... but Jack didn't Turn him. Ianto has always Been.
That's what Clem's smelling of "the Queer" means.
And that, friends, dead or not, is fucking awesome.

Comments

[sabotabby]

I totally feel like a dolt for not catching the 10% thing.

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

I don't.

It's a false statistic I always forget anyway in regards to the whole "One in Ten" Gays... so, *shrug*.

But as I said, it really fits with the prism presented in mao4269's interpretation.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_yggdrasil/]

More on how it was too fucking long, too fucking boring and one again, too fucking shallow, at a later date.

Awwwwww :(

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

Pretty much.
They really missed the mark with the characterisation, imo.

[whereisjoy.livejournal.com]

hey, dumb question, but HP is being released in english? I have a couple of days off starting this evening and I want to go see it in Jerusalem, but honestly, negotiating this task in Israeli society (i.e. Heebrew) is intimidating.

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

It's in English.
It's very rare for a kids movie to arrive without an original version.
We're more into subtitles than dubbing, unless it's a clearly kid's movie and those are usually shown during the day, not an evening viewing.

[tamara-russo.livejournal.com]

Plus, most dubbed movies have two versions - english (or whatever the original language is, they dubbed "Spirited Away"... Fools) and Hebrew.

[echoingvista.livejournal.com]

While I would never call COE homophobic, because you're right, it absolutely is not, I think comparing everything that happened to the AIDS epidemic is giving Russell far, far too much credit. The comparison is there, definitely, but I think that's something that smart, possibly over-analyzing fans see and come up with.

Russell definitely has agendas that show in his writing, but, surprisingly, a gay agenda isn't one of them.

I mean, this is the man who thought Lisa's cyberman outfit should be "sexy" (instead of gruesome, which is what it would have been, realistically), which is quite possibly the most offensive thing I can think of. He can be a brilliant writer, but he doesn't really think in complexities.

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

It's not a comparison, it's a theme that emerges. One that makes sense through the prism I mention. You don't have to agree, but really, the author may be the authority when it comes to what is written... but readers/viewers catch a whole lot more that writers ever intended or suss things out utterly differently than intended (I don't follow Gwen-centric fandom, but she is certainly not the main character fans love, like RTD thought she would be, as far as I'm aware).

It may not be a "Gay Agenda", but post-sexual thinking is definitely there.

I agree with your final paragraph 100%.

[alba17.livejournal.com]

I pretty much agree. See my post on same topic: http://alba17.livejournal.com/62859.html#cutid1

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

Will comment there!

[sefkhet.livejournal.com]

I kind of love you.

You have taken all of the ramblyish, not-particularly-coherent thoughts that have been in my head for the last ten days and said all of it so much better than I could have managed. Ianto Jones as I saw him in Children of Earth made him a freaking role model for LGBTQ youth, but fandom at large is giving me the impression that that's just me.

My thoughts on how Ianto's sexuality was portrayed are mostly laid out in this way-too-long comment (http://1perfectanomaly.livejournal.com/41079.html?thread=142967#t142967).

In so far as his death goes, it's not that I don't see the issue with killing off the queer character or the fact that we weary of it being done all the bloody time, but Ianto didn't die because he was queer, he died because he was Torchwood. I have this big reset button in my head and I'm loathe to let go of it just yet, but this has been coming ever since he and Gwen looked at the picture of the very, very young staff of Torchwood 1916 and he said, "Some things never change."

(Linked from torchwood_three, sorry for invading your journal!)

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

Aww man... *blushes*

Thank you! I'm happy you liked my commentary, which is kind of rambly as well... but dude, we're fangrrls/fanbois! It's what we do!

And no problem with the invasion :) If it's public it's game to be read and commented upon.

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

And I read your comment and agree with you whole heartedly. The environment in which Ianto grew up and the casual homophobia that is part of the deal; that casualness that I had to put up with today... oy.

[schwarze-elster.livejournal.com]

Hi, I liked this. I liked CoE in all his nihilistic glory and the way so many people latch onto things they thought were homophobic to give them a reason to discredit the show annoys me. There were certainly things that can be discussed in this light, but nothing's ever black or white, especially not in Torchwood. Why don't people just say they didn't like the show because it was cruel to Jack? In my opinion that's a much better reason to dislike it than supposed homophobia.
But enough of that. I write this comment to share a thought about the 10%. I think it could also refer to the tithe (Is this right? I looked it up on LEO.) of christian church. I think it's a nice parallel to the twelve virgins for the old gods metaphor this torchwood agent of '65 used. Like, the old gods wanted 12 as a sacrifice, the new want 10%. So... pretty mean jibe at christianity, but it wouldn't be the first time what with Tosh and Ianto shooting monks in Exit Wounds. Also, Torchwood is pretty much the most atheist series in the world. I think it's pretty funny in a morbid way. Y/N?

[eumelia.livejournal.com]

New-Who and Trochwood very much express RTD's atheist philosophy, which I like.
Even Buffy the Vampire Slayer, which was also created by a proclaimed atheist (Joss Whedon) often fell into the trap of Good/Evil which is very much entrenched in religion, and specifically Christianity as far as I'm aware, but I'm really not an authority on any religion (being an agnsto-atheist myself).

There was a whole lot of political/social commentary and critique going on in CoE and for sure religion was in there.

Is it funny? Well, I like a show that doesn't make assumptions about it's audience, other than assuming we're somewhat intelligent, so you know :)

And I'm glad you liked this!

[schwarze-elster.livejournal.com]

Oh right. What I meant was I thought it was funny, but I'm not a christian. I also think everything going so very wrong because the government prefers killing off witnesses instead of finding solutions for example by working with Torchwood is funny. It's also really depressing and depressingly real. CoE was very depressing. I'd like to believe in the good of humanity or something like that. I mean it's just not fair: Season 1 and 2 say, there's no afterlife, there's nothing but life and then season 3 kind of sais even life can be pretty miserable. So I guess, the only thing I can do is laugh about it. Don't know if this makes sense.